The Hub is the premier site for online fiction, bringing you only the best stories and poetry by the most talented writers. The Hub was founded with a simple philosophy: to bring together quality fiction and poetry by authors regardless of sexual preference, gender identity, race, age or any other labels. We host fiction and poetry by a number of extremely talented authors, including Tanya Allan, Rob Hawes, Julien Gregg, Johnny Dawson, Ieshwar, Bev, Kitty and many more. New authors are always welcome at the site, and readers are invited to join our Community forums.
The Hub Writing Site & Community
Author, Rating and Tags:
Submitted by Rob Hawes on Wed, 2008/01/02 - 3:04pm
Printer-friendly version
»
- Login or register to post comments
- Printer-friendly version



The Hub is closed
Looking for something new to read, so clicked on The Hub link in the titlebar. Their homepage has the following:
A new site will be opening to replace The Hub towards the end of 2008. In the meantime author sites remain online, but other areas of the site are now offline.
The Community will remain online to current members, but will be closed to non-members and registrations are now disabled.
If you would like to know when the new site opens, please email rob@hub-writing.org.
The new site appears to be at http://authorshaunt.com/
I have not looked at it so I can't say what it's like.
KJT
"Being a girl is wonderful and to torture someone into that would be like the exact opposite of what it's like. I don’t know how anyone could act that way." College Girl - poetheather
Karen J.
* * *
I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle. - Winston Churchill
Angel, You Are One In A Million, Make That A Billion My Friend
Hopefully he will listen to you. I always enjoy reading your blogs, comments and stories. Your wit and charm always shine through. Yous story Drew Meets Angel is a refreshing breath of fresh air as we see Drew/Gaby through your eyes. I am glad that you are posting it here.
May Your Light Forever Shine
May Your Light Forever Shine
The Hub is different, I'll give them that. They have a lot to...
...offer writers who wish to utilize workshops, and the many tools the Hub offers its members. I must warn you though! If you post a story in their vault you must realize that they have a very intensive, all encompassing rating, and warning system, for each posting.
YOU MUST USE THEIR RATING AND WARNING SYSTEM TO THE LETTER!
They will help you with this and they will add warning ratings if your story has something they haven't yet warned others about. I know, they added a couple after I posted just three of my stories there, three of my tame ones! Giggle, giggle. Zenda the Magician, The Explorers Club, and the one that caused a big hullabaloo, "Christmas Surprise."
I have nothing against the HUB, they seem like well intentioned people over there and they have awesome stories by several fantastic writers. They even have Tanya Allan and Scott Ramsey. I fell in love with one of their authors writings. Look up Bev's stuff when you visit them.
Just remember this...They have a very extensive rating system, and an all inclusive story warning system there. I've never seen anything so inclusive as theirs anywhere else on the web, so be warned if you are going to post anything in our genre there in the VAULT.
Erin tells me it's because of their location. I guess they don't have as much freedom in their country as we do here where writing stories is concerned. Thank Heaven for the Big Closet Top Shelf and a web mistress second to none running the show here!
(This is my opinion of this site and others my differ, which I am sure they will. I base my opinion on my actual experience there and dealing with the powers that be.)

"Be Your-Self, So Easy to Say, So Hard to Live!"
Thanks for the comment
Angel,
The rating system at The Hub is a very simple one and the staff are there to help authors who have difficulty with it - as you did. You were also informed that in the very near future we will be applying a new announcement system in The Vault, so all you would have to do is apply an appropriate rating from a choice of four:
S - Safe for all readers
C - Cautionable Content
D - Distressing Content
M - Mature Content
The ratings you applied to your story were corrected and you were contacted and informed that the changes were made - a courtesy we pay to all our authors. You objected to those ratings being changed. I respect that. However, I do disagree that our ratings system "complex".
The ratings we currently have exist to isolate our site from legal problems. I am aware of another site, based in the US, that has been sued for failing to apply appropriate ratings, warnings and disclaimers to the work published thereon. It is an issue all writing sites need to deal with. The Big Closet does it, utilising a system that is equally as complicated as ours, as do the vast majority of other writing sites.
We have provided help pages and guides for authors and members to help them to understand our rating and warning systems, and our staff are at hand to provide further guidance. Any complexity is balanced by the abundance of help on offer to authors.
I respect you as an author and I'm sorry you didn't feel The Hub was the site for you. I also thank you for your comments here. Good luck for the future.
Rob
My Site: http://rob.hub-writing.org/
Okay, let me be more specific then Mr. Hawes. You wrote...
"The rating system at The Hub is a very simple one and the staff are there to help authors who have difficulty with it - as you did. You were also informed that in the very near future we will be applying a new announcement system in The Vault, so all you would have to do is apply an appropriate rating from a choice of four:
S - Safe for all readers
C - Cautionable Content
D - Distressing Content
M - Mature Content"
I did not have difficulty with these Mr. Hawes, I simply chose the ones I thought pertained to my stories. I could not believe they needed the strictest rating your site requires though. Your Librarian reassigned the ratings to...
"D" Distressing Content as you define as..."Stories with this rating contain scenes of explicit sex or violence or scenes or themes that may be distressing to some readers including non-graphic scenes of rape or murder, sexual abuse, sexualised violence, extreme physical abuse or the ongoing physical abuse of a minor, some themes of death or suicide, or other unsettling content. Though our ratings are not based on the age of readers, stories with this rating are generally suitable for readers over the age of 16."
I did not and still do not believe my two stories, The Explorers Club and Zenda the Magician earned this level of rating. Be that as it may the one that really blew me away was the one that was changed to the highest level of ratings, "Christmas Surprise"
That story had assigned to it by your librarian, "M" Mature Content and on your site you define that rating as,
"Stories with this rating are completely unsuitable for sensitive readers as they contain graphic scenes of rape, murder, torture, extreme violence, fetishistic sexual practices or other scenes or themes of an explicit and disturbing nature, including non-graphic scenes of sexual abuse against a minor. Though our ratings are not based on the age of readers, stories with this rating are unsuitable for all readers under the age of 18."
I will include here the link to your page for your required rating and warning system so those reading this can judge for themselves free from any bias from mine and your posts.
http://hub-writing.org/codes.php#Warnings
The topic we have discussed so far are for the BASIC RATING for a story. Now, let me tell the readers of this posting about your WARNING CODES that you require ALL stories to include as well.
I'll just do this quickly....
'A' 'B' 'D' 'F' 'G' 'R' 'S' 'T' 'U' and 'V'. That's 10 different codes that those posting stories to your site must know and if one sentence in their story contains even the implied meaning of any of these by your Librarian or administrators, then it had best be listed. I will let those who want to click on the link above to read what each of these "10" code letters represent.
PS..."F" and "U" were added to this list as a result of my stories posted in the vault. I can and am often straightforward to the point of being blunt when I respond to insensitive comments made to me. I did so with your Librarian, but I was never insulting to any of your staff.
Huggles Mr. Hawes

This is my opinion and my comments alone. I take full responsibility for what I write here and state it as true and factual.
"Be Your-Self, So Easy to Say, So Hard to Live!"
Thank You Again For Your Comments
Angel,
Thank you again for your comments. Unfortunately, I didn't get the chance to read your stories before you removed them. However, my "Vault Manager" - the lady you insist on referring to as a "librarian" - informs me that the story contains scenes that she interpreted as depicting child abuse - something about a child being forced to dress as a girl with threats of violence and humiliation. If this is the case, the rating should have been "D", not "M". However, the rating you applied to the story was "S", which was wholly inappropriate, based on what I've been told.
Regardless, I am not going to put my rating system or staff members on trial here. It comes down to this - you disagreed with the way we run The Hub and you elected to leave. Had you come to me in my capacity as Writing Site Manager, I would have looked into the situation and addressed it with you directly, even worked with you to modify our rating system if appropriate. However, you elected to leave the site and due to the manner in which you elected to leave, I would prefer not to continue airing this matter publicly. Please contact me privately if you feel that there are changes that should be made to The Hub to improve things for authors.
I do want to comment on your false assertion that the warning codes "F" and "U" were added as a result of work you published in The Vault. While it is true that one of your stories, which I am told involved an adult being forced to wear diapers, would be classed as having fetishistic content, these codes were added as a result of a letter I received from a solicitor regarding a story that was published in The Hub's Library. Evidently a visitor read that story and was so distressed about the content that she felt compelled to talk to her solicitor.
Now, we have no doubt that we could win any legal action that woman decided to bring against us. However, we currently do not have the funds to fight such action. As a compromise, we agreed to add warning codes for fetishistic content and adult situations involving minors. It was absolutely nothing to do with you.
However, you decided that these warnings were added as a result of your work, and rather than ask me about it you posted a public and extremely inflammatory message on the forum. In that message, you said:
"What is interpreted as a fetish by a reader might not be a fetish to the author especially with the way the scene in question was written."
This was after I had already said:
"Here's a rule to remember when judging fetishistic content: When you wrote the scene, was it your intention to stimulate sexual arousal in a character or in your readers? If not, no warning is required."
That was posted in the same thread. Also, in your communications with me you said that you were offended because you felt I was saying ALL TG stories would require a fetish warning. I would like to address that publicly as you don't seem to have taken in what I said to you privately. Transgenderism is not a fetish. Crossdressing is a fetish if done for sexual gratification, but being transgendered is not a fetish and would not be labeled as such on my site. If I even tried, I would lose two authors I've come to consider good friends - Tanya Allan and Heather Rose Brown - and my best friend, who is also a member and transgendered, would kick my backside for me. In the thread about the new warnings, I said:
"Following a note from a member asking for clarification, I want to add that crossdressing will be considered a fetish if done for sexual reasons only."
Kitty, our Community Manager, said:
""Transgender" does not equate to "fetish". "Cross-dressing" does not equate to "fetish". However, a TG or crossdressing story may contain fetishistic content, just as a gay or heterosexual story may contain fetishistic content. If it does, it needs to have the appropriate codes and ratings applied."
I then added:
"I feel it is very, very important to stress this. Transgenderism is not a fetish, and will never be considered a fetish here at The Hub. Someone close to me is transgendered and I would be offended by anyone who suggested that they were transitioning for sexual reasons. There is nothing sexual about it.
When it comes to transgender/crossdressing issues, the fetish code only applies in those stories where a character dresses in clothes because wearing those clothes gives them sexual pleasure, or where a character wears clothes (by force or voluntarily) because it gives another character sexual pleasure. The principle applies equally to straight and gay fiction - I know a few people who like their husbands to dress up as firemen or their wives to dress up as nurses. That is a fetish to."
Angel, I'm sorry if you took offense and assumed that we were calling transgenderism a fetish. However, I don't see how we could be any more clear about it. It's not a fetish. One of your stories contained fetishistic content as a character was compelled to dress up in diapers. It doesn't matter whether the story was straight, gay, lesbian, bi, transgendered or asexual - any story containing such content would receive a fetish warning. However, as your work was published in The Vault, no warning needed to be applied and thus you upset yourself over nothing.
Now, I appreciate your comments and I appreciate that this situation was upsetting for you. It was upsetting for me too. I hope we are able to part on friendly terms, but I do not intend to address this matter further in this public forum. I will happily address any comments or questions made to me by you or any member here on my own forum or via my site email - rob[at]hub-writing.org. However, this is not The Hub and it is not the place to debate Hub policy.
I appreciate you alerting people as to our thorough warning and ratings system. I regret that it is necessary, and anyone who doesn't want to work within such a system should certainly not come to The Hub to publish their work. However, I hope that the members here will also take my comments into account before judging my site - or better still come and have a look for themselves.
Thank you for your feedback. If you email me I will be happy to discuss this matter with you further. If not, take care and all the best in the future.
Rob Hawes
Site Administrator, The Hub
EDIT - Since writing this message, a visitor spammed The Hub's guestbook with links to The Big Closet and this blog. The IP used matches Angel's. Angel - I'm sorry you are unhappy regarding this situation, but please stop spamming my site. I view spam as a form of vandalism. Cease and desist now.
My Site: http://rob.hub-writing.org/
The Vault
Your site looks like it is based upon an interesting concept and it perked my interest as to whether it may be a worthy place to join as a reader or as an author. However, I was rather put off by the optics of The Vault in your library. To me it points to dusty old collections not worthy of being in the public eye.
It may not have been your intention, but I see it as uninviting to new authors.
A possible reason...
I see what you are saying about the optics of The Vault, but you have to understand that the setup for The Hub is very different than BC. I belong to a couple of sites with very similar setups, mainly those that run IPB, and The Vault is by far the best looking one of the lot. Furthermore, most other sites that use the 'e-fiction board' set up (which is basically what The Vault is) allow comments to be made directly on the page, whereas at The Hub one has to go the main forums to provide authors feedback (or contact them). This, in my opinion, is a great way to promote author recognition where it is due. Also, the guidelines for featured and resident author hosting (which provide promoted authors with VERY attractive and visually BEAUTIFUL personal pages) can be found on the main writing page, which is an amazing incentive for authors posting at The Vault who want 'something more'.
I have found that The Hub is very possibly one of the most author-friendly sites out there right now, and that friendship isn't only provided by Rob Hawes and Kitty, but also by every single one of their members. I think you should give it a chance, especially if you're interested in receiving semi-live feedback from a community of very active readers :O.
(: Maddy (:
Neat site!
Rob and Kitty have something going that is much like something I wanted to try: a general writing site. Good writing and good design, take a look. I've given Rob permission to invite TheHub's authors to post on BC their TG fiction that doesn't fit in with Rob's needs on his site.
= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.
= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.
selective?
Is the Hub a selective site, where they only allow certain levels of criteria? or is it growing to become a site where anyone can post? Hmmmmmm maybe this is a site for "Healing a Princess".
A.A.
To add a little to what Rob said...
While The Vault is open, I believe it is very important to say that it is NOT an archive like Nifty (where a myriad of very inappropriate 'genres' are afloat)...
Just wanted to make that clear for anyone else who is reading this :D
Maddy
Please don't take it away.
Gwen Brown
Re: selective?
Anyone can post stories or poetry at The Hub, regardless of ability. We have an open fiction section called The Vault where our Guest Authors (non-hosted authors) can post their work, and three levels of hosting for more advanced authors.
We are selective when it comes to choosing our Resident Authors, but anyone can become a Guest Author and post their work in The Vault and anyone who writes well will be offered their own Featured Author site - though please bear in mind that we have a small waiting list for hosting at the moment.
Rob :)
My Site: http://rob.hub-writing.org/