I need some writing advice

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I need some help with a story I am writing. I have a difficult situation and the solution I have come up with sort of works, but it's not perfect. I also don't want to say too much as I'm near the end of the story and with some cooperation from my muse I could have it done within the next few months. A couple of months you say, well after I finish this story I have to go back to the original story and re work some of it so the two stories are completely in sync with each other.

So here is the scenario, the main character is a M2F. In order to survive the character has developed a split personality; the male part, and the greater female part. Both parts are fully aware of the other's existence and even engage in conversations with each other.

Doesn't sound too bad you say, "what's the problem?"

How do you say things so that the reader knows who is the one in charge?

Malename is in charge presenting a male so call the character by the male name. Straightforward I have no problems with this scenario.

Femalename is in charge presenting as female so call the character by the female name. Again straightforward I have no problems with this scenario.

Presenting to the world as malename but femalename is in charge. Now things get a bit trickier. When other characters are talking to or about the main character it is simple, just use the pronouns the way the other characters see the main character. But when the narrative is talking about the main character, do I carry the perspective from the other character's point of view or do I use the narrator's superior perspective point of view.

Presenting to the world as femalename but malename is in charge. See the previous paragraph.

Then we get to the really tough one. There are certain circumstances where the two personalities, become a gestalt personality. Where the two are no longer two but one whole personality. How do I refer to this new state? Again if it is from the other character's points of view then use the terms appropriate for the character that they see. But when it comes to the narrative point of view or the main character's point of view how do I do it?

I had thought to do something like this: "They could not believe what they were hearing." but this does not necessarily convey the fact that it is the male character that the other characters see, but it does convey that it is the gestalt character in charge.

Now for a really difficult situation. When it is the gestalt character and another character being referenced in the same sentence: "They and Janice stood watching the sun set."

Now with this last example you might say come up with a name that is a combination of the two characters names. Well I did think of this but I don't like the combined names I've come up with. You might also say change the characters' names so that they work together to form a combined name. I've been working with the characters' names now for over two years, I'm kind of stuck on them and really don't want to change them.

I don't want to end up doing something that will require giving an explanation to the reader either. Using the italics seems to be easy enough to figure out, but in some situations the clarity of the situation fades and becomes a bit confusing.

So if anyone has any good idea's or suggestions I'd be happy to listen and see if they will work for my situation.

Arwen

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Tough call

Does the melding come at a certain point in the story and stay there, or does the schism stay while they (both m and f personae) are in agreement? If the former, then I would integrate that decision into the story with the singular personality's name and go from there; if the latter, then perhaps the best choice is the third person POV and then use internal dialogue to show the distress of the misreference or perhaps even use the controlling persona's name, i.e. "What?!" Jane asked or "Yeah, whatever," John said.
Another alternative is the classic John/Jane label for the speaker, with the controlling persona listed first.
Just a few ideas, I hope they help.
Hugs
Diana

It's love that makes them whole

Diana,

It is love that makes them whole. When they are in the presence of the one they love or they think about her that the two of them become one.

I have use italics on the pronouns to indicate when they are in gestalt mode as opposed to when they are just two separate personalities.

It does become cumbersome though. Trying to keep track of the proper perspective for the use of the italics can get a bit confusing and deciding which is the most appropriate way to refer to them / them in narration at a given moment.

Thank you for taking the time to help me.

Arwen

I Am Glad To Help

When in Gestalt, have character refer to self as "WE" and then choose gestalt gender according to story unless others know of the identity crisis.
May Your Light Forever Shine

    Stanman
May Your Light Forever Shine

No one knows but them.

Stanman,

Even the very few who know the main character is TG don't know that they have a split personality. They are the only ones who know about it. Also since this in not a first person story there is no place I can think of off hand to use the WE scenario.

Thanks for your suggestion though.

Arwen

One way could be john talks

One way could be john talks flanked by *hey* and Jane by >hey<.

Love,

Paula

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.

The Coda
Chapterhouse: Dune

Love,

Paula

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.

The Coda
Chapterhouse: Dune

Thanks

Paula,

Thanks for your suggestion. I never thought of this approach. I'll go back and see if it works for the story.

Arwen

Wish I could help.

The more I think about how to do this, the more what you are doing makes sense to me. What is happening is outside my experience.

I disassociate a lot, but I am not conscious of two different personalities. People tell me that it is like the lights are on but no one is home. Sometimes I know where I went, and others not.

I have wanted to experience "kink oriented spanking" to help me understand something else about me, but no dom or anyone else for that matter will touch me. My Shrink says not to play with it because I may leave and not come back.

It only makes me more curious.

Gwen

It's not easy

Gwen,

It's not all that easy for me at times and I've been working with the story in one form or another for over a year and the characters for over two.

My big fear though is in the end it won't be clear to the reader, who is the one in charge at a given moment. I have the advantage of having written it but there are times I go back and cover a section and think did I mean it this way or did I mean it that way. Different day different perspective.

I hope that when it is all written and edited that people will like the story.

Arwen

Presenting to the world as

Presenting to the world as malename but femalename is in charge. Now things get a bit trickier. When other characters are talking to or about the main character it is simple, just use the pronouns the way the other characters see the main character. But when the narrative is talking about the main character, do I carry the perspective from the other character's point of view or do I use the narrator's superior perspective point of view.

Presenting to the world as femalename but malename is in charge. See the previous paragraph.

That depends on what point of view the narrator is taking. Is the narrator's voice "superior perspective" as you say? or is it, in fact, coloured by a particular character (most likely the main two characters). In either case, I wouldn't suggest going by what OTHER characters use in terms of name/pronouns, unless of course it is those character's perspectives that you are writing from.

One option would be to simply use the dominant personality's name, but the presenting gender. "femalename ties his shoelaces", gives the clear impression that the female personality is in control, but VISUALLY, is appearing male. I think that would be easiest, in terms of keeping it simple for the reader. If you were to always use the pronouns of the gender of the personality, it would be much harder to keep straight in one's mind how they were presenting at the moment. But perhaps in the internal dialogue of the main characters, they would always use the correct gender pronouns in refering to themselves and their 'twin'.

Then we get to the really tough one. There are certain circumstances where the two personalities, become a gestalt personality. Where the two are no longer two but one whole personality. How do I refer to this new state? Again if it is from the other character's points of view then use the terms appropriate for the character that they see. But when it comes to the narrative point of view or the main character's point of view how do I do it?

Would this personality more closely resemble a THIRD unique personality, resulting in the "marriage" of the two base personalities? Or would it only be the two main personalities being equally "in control" at the moment. IE a new individual, or some sort of shared consciousness. If it's the latter, than I would go with the use of "they/them", and if the former, a new name entirely (not a joint one).

Now for a really difficult situation. When it is the gestalt character and another character being referenced in the same sentence: "They and Janice stood watching the sun set."

For this, again it depends on the situation above. If it's a independent personality, then use the new third name, and if it is a shared-consciousness type deal, then you will probably have to go with the they/them/we thing. But, you could also use words like "the pair", "twins", "Femalename & malename...". With the last one I would try to avoid lists of names when describing the actions. IE NOT "femalename, malename, and Lisa went out the door" but rather "femalename & malename, followed Lisa out". It'll be tough, but just watch your composition to ensure that the two main characters remain a clearly defined grouping in your sentences.

Another thing to keep in mind is make sure to reuse their name periodically so you don't go too long with he/she/them/they without seeing a name to attach to the pronouns. And in the case of the shared-consciousness, just periodically go... mark/mary, or Mark & Mary, did... just so you don't get too many theys floating around without an anchor.

Also, if it suits the format of the story, you could declare the dominant personality at the beginning of the chapter/section/whatever. Or the shared-personality, as the case may be. But you don't want to rely on this to keep things clear, too much.

Thank you

Calei,

I think I'm doing most of what you suggested where it is appropriate in the story. I never meant to set out writing a story that ended up with such a complicated way of viewing the main character. Unfortunately the characters and my muse had other ideas.

Thank you for your suggestions.

Arwen

Don't confuse ...

... whatever you do.

It sounds like what you have planned is pretty complex. What's that, three voices as well as the regular voices of everyone else? Still, there are any number of ways to go. The point is to be consistent. You could use the time-honored:

Jerry: "I'm not so sure this a good idea."

Jessie: "Come, on, live a little!"

For thoughts, italics:

Jerry: I can't believe you just did that.

Or, you could use brackets and braces for internal speech:

[Are you insane? Why didn't you let it go?]

{Maybe I didn't like him. He deserved it anyway.}

And italics within brackets and braces for private thoughts:

[Why didn't I just let it go?]

Whatever. It doesn't much matter, consistency is the key.

Aardvark

"Happiness is when what you think, what you say, and what you do are in harmony."

Mahatma Gandhi

"Happiness is when what you think, what you say, and what you do are in harmony."

Mahatma Gandhi

Confusion is what I'm trying to avoid

Aardvark,

I don't want to confuse my reader at all. It is one of my fears that I've written it and read it so many times that it is clear to me what is happening, but it won't be clear to my reader.

I'll be getting someone to read/proof/edit before I post though, so hopefully the finished product will be clear to the reader.

Thank you for your suggestions.

Arwen

You're braver than I

I started a story that would have been a single person - but in three phases of life (40s-50s, mid-late 20s & youth/teen)... I got a ways in, but it was getting confusing which time frame and how to set the personality of the main character in those times. I finally "chickened" out and put the story away. Perhaps, if/when I get to be a more accomplished author, I'll pull it back out, and see if it's worth finishing, but who knows.

In any event, if it's not obviouis from "context" how the character is presenting, and which personality is "in charge", then visual queues are critical. If you decide to go with visual queues - you may need to include a "legend" somewhere (or foot notes the first time each is used.

Good Luck!

Annette

Not brave

Annette,

I don't think I'm being all that brave. This story takes place over a few years before my story from From the Ashes. Basically from the time the main characters meet to the time they get married. There are a few years gap in the middle between the beginning of From the Ashes and the end of Secrets of the Heart. So although the two stories are told out of sequence they are chronological in each story.

So my issues are mainly from a pronoun / name / clarity for the reader point of view.

As I'm going to re edit From the Ashes I don't think it is worth reading it now in case you were thinking of doing that. Wait till I've posted both stories here and on Fictionmania.

Arwen

Beverly Taff's picture

This is a tough one.

The problem is keeping the reader's attention focused on whichever character is referencing.
It seems to me you might have to employ different fonts (even different colours perhaps.)for different facets of the two characters and gently introduce the reader to a series of short 'familiarisation' chapters at the beginning of the book so that the reader has time to assimilate the different identities to the differing fonts and colours.

I had to do this in a very long and complex legal affidavite once where several hospitals, doctors, courts and assorted care agencies were involved at different overlapping times and dates plus different locations.
At the beginning I laid out a key clours and fonts to guide the reader through all the complexities.

The judge commented upon the idea and stated that it made the affidavit much easier to follow.

There are dozen's of fifferent fonts and colours to assist any author in this.

Think about it and see if it works.

Beverly.

At an LGBT Excellence function with the wedding cake we cannot have.

Bev, unable to eat her cake (yet)!.jpeg

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